Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

appianfreak — Thu, 20 Feb 2020 14:46:28 GMT

Just wanted to clarify, I started from scratch with new simple Process Model. If anyone has the time they could reproduce in few minutes (version 19.4). Or not.

Define CDT
Define Data Store Entity
Define ProcessModel (accepts CDT id)
- Script Task (for loading CDT if id passed int)
- User Input Task (for accepting new / modifications to CDT)
- Write Data Entity Smart Service (for saving CDT)
Application Action referring the Process Model
Record Type to display CDTs and Related Action (referring to Process Model and passing CDT id to it)

So deleted versions of the PM are not a factor here. I will try and get independent verification within my organization and report back here when I can. I trust Appian folks lurk on the forums in case someone else can verify what I'm seeing especially outside my organization.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

davel001150 — Thu, 20 Feb 2020 14:34:40 GMT

He may be onto something though with your deleted components of the same name. That could just be echos of the deleted ones causing you to have to go through all the rigmarole when you want to make an edit.

If that's it, I think you've got a nice product defect to alert Appian about. People generally don't love hearing about defects at first, but they love removing them.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

appianfreak — Wed, 19 Feb 2020 17:10:35 GMT

I did think about this, and not because I had some particular insight into Appian, but rather because whenever I used to select any artifact using "auto-complete", I would see other same/similarly named objects. Sometimes, I could easily verify I was selecting my object, sometimes I couldn't.

Since this testbed environment is being used by various folks, essentially following the same tutorial script, I learnt very early, like a month back, to prefix/suffix each of the artifacts I was creating with my initials, so as to eliminate accidently sucking in someone else's code.

So that's really not it. Your export/import suggestion I'm unfortunately not in position to explore. I have access to just this one Appian environment.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

ManuelHTG — Wed, 19 Feb 2020 17:01:41 GMT

Could it be as well that you have the process model duplicated and / or inside another application? I think you can have duplicated names if there are not in the same application.

So, to make sure, you could try to find your process model from different path, and make sure that there is not another somewhere-else

For example, if you have the process model "APP Process Model", go to Appian Designer and on the top select objects (without getting in to an application), the search "APP Process Model"

Then, go to your APP, select the objects "folder" and search within the older your process model.

If you identify that the "APP Process Model" is in two places at the same time, that could explain your estrange behavior.

Another test i would do is to export the application and import it somewhere else, that would already show you if you have some missing objects or wrong references.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

Mike Schmitt — Wed, 19 Feb 2020 16:29:11 GMT

Good luck, let me know if you hear anything definitive from them.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

appianfreak — Wed, 19 Feb 2020 16:23:00 GMT

Yes, Save and Publish every time on the PM. And yes, now that I know what the heck is going on, I can reproduce the problem at will.

What I also know is that this behavior I only started noticing around 10 days back, and I also know the environment was patched with something. So it's possible something simply messed up.

I will report to my org CoE so they can independently verify if its some install issue or case should be opened with Appian. I'm hoping it is something at our end because I cannot believe no one else outside my organization is seeing this behavior with 19.4. So as of right now, I will assume problem at my end.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

Mike Schmitt — Wed, 19 Feb 2020 16:18:15 GMT

[quote userid="42721" url="~/discussions/f/process/18324/related-action-referring-to-ghost-process-model-version/72209"]Whenever I make a change to the Process Model, it will not get picked up UNLESS I re-configure/re-save dependents. So in my case, I had to go to the Record Type Related Action, remove the Process Model reference, re-add it, and Save.[/quote]

If this is true and you can reproduce this behavior on demand, then you should consider opening a support case with Appian if possible, because this does not reflect the intended behavior or my experience whatsoever.

Just to double check, you are using the "save and publish" functionality (ctrl-alt-S) every time you save your process model, right? Most experienced designers I know of do this by default in most situations, since not doing so can cause unexpected issues.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

appianfreak — Wed, 19 Feb 2020 16:10:02 GMT

Okay, I think I have it now.

Whenever I make a change to the Process Model, it will not get picked up UNLESS I re-configure/re-save dependents. So in my case, I had to go to the Record Type Related Action, remove the Process Model reference, re-add it, and Save. For Application Action also I had to do same thing. THEN unpublish/publish application so that the "Related Action" will pickup the Process Model changes and therefore render Task link under Tempo Tasks, and also so that "Application Action" under Tempo Tasks picks up the Process Model changes and therefore render Task link under Tempo Tasks.

This is absolutely Insane!

For now, I'm going to ignore and focus on continuing my learning. Essentially I'm going to discover real quick whether if I modify ANY Appian artifact, it means I have to walk UP the dependent tree and re-save all references to the modified artifact so I can be certain, my changes are going to get picked up.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

appianfreak — Wed, 19 Feb 2020 15:13:01 GMT

No its a testbed environment setup in my organization so folks such as I can go learn.

One thing I did learn is sometimes when debugging within Process Modeler, it picks up the draft version. I've learnt that the hard way. I do know I'm picking up the current process model version now (v 23.0 since I've been thinking my Process Model changes not getting saved).

One clue I have when I know Task is not going to show up in Tempo is this. The Instance shows up in Appian Designer Monitoring tab, BUT inside the Process Designer Process Instances tab, it is not visible. Anytime this happens Task item will not show in Tempo. Nevermind that if I click the Instance from Appian Designer Monitoring tab, it will open up in Process Designer, and I can check the properties and I can SEE my User Input Task, while if I go and check Process Intances in Process Designer, I still don't see the instance!.

So I know the symptoms that tell me I'm going to have a problem, but the cause still eludes me. Sometimes unpublishing / publishing Application solves my problem. However, that's not been working lately. Accidently things work and I'm able to make some changes, but then again it will fail. All of which is taking so much of my time.

The version of Appian is 19.4. Maybe there is a bug list and patches that have not been applied in my environment. That's my only hope.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

Mike Schmitt — Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:53:36 GMT

[quote userid="42721" url="~/discussions/f/process/18324/related-action-referring-to-ghost-process-model-version/72179"]I'm seeing such inconsistencies with my Appian[/quote]

By any chance are you running a local install that you installed yourself? In the past I've seen cases where incomplete / incorrect configurations result in weird / inconsistent behavior on the front end.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

appianfreak — Tue, 18 Feb 2020 21:41:31 GMT

Great advice. I thought the same thing. The behavior is consistent. I've done this 3 times since morning.

I created a dummy CDT, a dummy process with User Input Task, a dummy interface form. Saved. Published.

I debugged process model, went To Tempo Tasks, completed User Input Task. Looked in my database table for record. All good.

I went to process model. Pretended to change something. Literally, I checked the

Allow the value for the variable to be provided when starting a process

option, then immediately unchecked it. Saved Properties. Saved PM. Published. So NO Change really.

I debugged process model. Task will not show up in Tempo.

I created new application. Did everything all over again. First time works. After pretending to change PM, second time it fails.

Then one more time I repeated the process. 2nd publish...wrecks it.

I'm seeing such inconsistencies with my Appian for the last 2 weeks I've been actively learning. I've published and unpublished the application. No dice (while this trick has worked in the past).

I really don't know what to do. I apologize to anyone reading this if I'm wasting their time.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

davel001150 — Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:59:09 GMT

Because deleting in Appian is super weird, perhaps create a related action with a completely different name, then make sure the PM you're trying to run doesn't have the same name as anything you deleted.

It could be that Appian sees an object with the same name as a deleted previous object, and runs the previously deleted one because it goes by names for reasons.

It's stuff like this that gave colleagues of mine the best practice of never deleting anything in Appian ever.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

davel001150 — Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:56:24 GMT

For sanity sake, how about creating a new PM that has nothing to do with any that have come before. Let it be just start node and end node. Configure the related action to run that PM and do nothing instead of whatever it was doing. Confirm that you can at least do that.

Afterward, try reconfiguring your related action to use the new PM you've been trying to get it to run.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

Mike Schmitt — Tue, 18 Feb 2020 15:56:08 GMT

There's a way you can try this without having to start from scratch with your process model. From your current process model, select "File" --> "Save As", which will save a copy of the original as a separate / new PM. Name it something noticeably different, then choose it as the related action PM instead of the original one, and see what happens when you try running it. If it works well, you could just switch to using the new one as your main related action PM, and ditch the old one.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

ManuelHTG — Tue, 18 Feb 2020 15:52:07 GMT

Hello,

I think conceptually there is something wrong of what you are doing.

You said that you introduced some debug variables to know which version of your process model you are running. For checking which version of the process model you are running, you should go to your application, select monitoring and check the version that the "Process Model" columns shows you.

That will help you to

1) check that the correct process model version is being picked up

2) See which values you variables are picking.

Additionally, if you have a process model with a start form, you can do "start process from debugging", that way you see better what is running.

I would not be removing and adding references and old versions of process models as it can leave you a mess behind. If you want to do further test, I would suggest to do a dummy interface with a constant that points to your process model and link to start the process model with a given parameters (for instance that way you can test with the values you should be giving from the related action)

Good luck!

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

appianfreak — Tue, 18 Feb 2020 15:33:59 GMT

I have deleted all existing process instances. This happens when creating new instances. As unbelievable as it may sound...

I'm just going to start from scratch with new process model, record action, etc. for my sanity sake.

Thanks!

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

appianfreak — Tue, 18 Feb 2020 15:32:24 GMT

I understand the latest should be picked up. That's exactly my quesiton.

Now I did delete old older process models since I wanted to stop pulling my hair. I'm just learning right now, so there is no other Record referencing the process model. Status is indeed just published and not disabled. Also no subprocesses.

I've just been suffering from n00b syndrome where some basic things are working for me (like in the other thread I'm reading a CDT instance which will not get assigned to my pv! variable while process model throws no error). This is for the same process model.

Thanks for replying and improving my understanding. I'll keep at it and hope to reply with something different.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

Chandra Sekhar Gattu — Sat, 15 Feb 2020 15:01:41 GMT

When you configure a process model for record related action, the process models latest published version will be picked to trigger an instance.

Is the process model published, without any errors? We often face issues, with deleting the process model versions. I would not recommend to delete the previous version, it will impact the parent processes that are using these.

Make sure that the latest version is in state "Published" not "Published disabled".

I assume that the PM configured as a related action is not a wrapper model which in turn calls a subprocess.

RE: Related Action referring to Ghost Process Model version

ManuelHTG — Sat, 15 Feb 2020 14:08:13 GMT

Hello,

The only way that could happen is if that related action is triggering a process model that is running (not a new one).

When you publish a new process model, non-completed processes of old process models are still running. You should check

1) Create a new record and do the necessary steps to execute that related action

2) Check in the monitoring non-completed running instances of your related action. If that is the case, delete those instances.

Let me know if that hel